When is the Best Time to Take Nattokinase?

11/21/2017

When taking any kind of supplement or medication, it is important to know how and when to take it. This can be an especially important question when asking about nattokinase, because nattokinase is classified as a systemic enzyme, which means it works throughout the body, or "system", to build and maintain overall health.

In order for a nattokinase supplement to effectively find its way into the system, it needs to pass through the acidic environment of the stomach in a reasonable amount of time. With this being said, the best time to take nattokinase is on an empty stomach, and preferably with at least 8 ounces of water....

An encapsulated supplement can take anywhere from 15-45 minutes to make its way through the stomach, depending on the individual person. If there is food in the stomach, it can inhibit the pass-through process, and the acidity can even begin to break down the enzymes, minimizing the ability of the nattokinase to assimilate into the body and provide maximum benefit. So, what is considered to be an empty stomach? Arthur Andrew Medical, a leading enzyme supplement brand, suggests at least one hour prior to eating and/or two hours after eating a meal. It should also be noted that it is okay to take nattokinase with coffee, juices, tea, and other supplements.

Nattokinase Dosage

Nattovena Nattokinase available at Southwest Nutraceuticals

How much nattokinase to take depends on several factors such as the user's age, health, and a few other factors. An individual that is looking to take a nattokinase supplement for general health and prevention will most certainly take a lower dosage than someone that has a more serious existing condition. Be sure to follow the guidelines on a product label, especially if it states a maximum dosage, if you are unsure.

At this time there is not enough scientific information to determine an appropriate range of doses for nattokinase, so keep in mind that natural products are not always necessarily safe, and understanding the proper dosages can be important. Once again, be sure to follow relevant directions on product labels, and consult your pharmacist, physician or other healthcare professional prior to using.

Sources:
https://www.webmd.com
https://www.arthurandrew.com/media/Nattokinase_Clinical_Data.pdf
https://www.globalhealingcenter.com/natural-health/difference-systemic-enzymes-digestive-enzymes/

112 Comments

Bruce Winter

11/1/2019 09:56:22 pm

I've been taking natto miso for years with supplements after the 1st meal. Now I'm seeing advice to take nattokinase on an empty stomach. Yes, it's a food and not a capsule so I'm wondering if I'm negating the benefits of the enzyme not taking it in non-food form. I just turned 80 and the low BP and blood work always draws comments.

John link

11/2/2019 08:59:00 am

Hi Bruce...you are still getting the benefits of natto, but in supplement form, nattokinase products are optimal when taken away from food (30-45 minutes before a meal, or 2 hours after a meal). This allows the enzymes to enter the body without being "distracted" by food nutrients.

Digestive enzyme supplements, which are meant to assist the body in the breakdown of foods, can and should be taken with a meal.

9/7/2020 11:33:26 am

I have been taking nattokinase 2000FU 2-3X/day on empty stomach for a DVT in lower leg... with very good results... much less swelling and pain in only a week. I refused taking Eliquis or Warfarin, after a ton of reading... much to my Doctor's anger.

Is it safe to add Lumbrokinase to the mix... or should I alternate every few weeks? I don't want blood to be overwhelmed, but need the dissolving action to be as strong as is reasonably safe.

I am also taking 80000SPU Serrapeptase 2X/day and applying topical 50%+ DMSO to leg 2X/day.

I'm very positive about this... knock on wood! Thx!

John link

9/10/2020 11:08:14 am

Hi JJ,
I think that taking both together will be expensive and redundant. If anything, maybe switch off every few weeks or a month at a time. This will also help you determine if one of them is providing a greater benefit to you. All the best!

9/10/2020 11:13:31 am

I think you mean taking Nattokinase and Lumbrokinase together... and agree... but I read that taking teh Natto-k and Serrapeptase apart but same day is fine... they seem to do some slightly different things and some similar things... with a DVT, I need anti-coagulation, and the Nattokinase and lumbrokinase I think are much better for that then the serrapeptase... but the Serra works great for the associated inflammation and pain, now much reduced...
Agree?

Val Hadley

7/4/2023 09:38:46 am

Hi John thanks so much for all this info!...but because my head is spinning on the new topic...

I know you recommend lumbrokinase over nattokinase for dissolving clots-

But what about is taking nattokinase (instead) for lowering cholesterol and (hopefully) dissolving plaque\calcification in arteries?

BY the way, I stumbled upon a fairly large medical study, which concluded 200 fu's on nattokinase isnt nearly enough to provide the benefits I'm seeking, but rather a minimum of 700 is needed (they got excellent results with over 1000 fu's in their study.

Thank you!!

John link

9/10/2020 11:32:02 am

Yes, I was referring to the lumbrokinase and nattokinase together. Serrapeptase is a fantastic enzyme to be supplementing for pain and inflammation issues. Great for breaking down fibrous tissues.

9/10/2020 11:41:31 am

Got it... any dosage recommendations? think the serrapeptase really needs to be enteric coated?

How about topical DMSO (and magnesium oil) on the bad leg? I think it would be very beneficial, was doing it from the start 10 days ago... lots of claims that it works on clots, especially ischemic strokes... but it may have contributed to what I think was a Herxheimer reaction... I am also considering drinking a small amount of DMSO with juice... but with the enzymes... might be a little much...

BTW: I appreciate your feedback!

Lisa Samuelsen

3/16/2021 07:20:02 am

I am currently taking Lumbrokinase (20mg) first thing in the morning, on an empty stomach. I am now going to be adding Nattokinase (100 mg) to my routine at night, also on an empty stomach. When researching how these supplements should be taken, I read Lumbrokinase is best in morning and Nattokinase us best at night. I don't know if taking both in the same day is over kill or not, but they both seem to have very good benefits and can work on different things.

Jeanne

3/1/2023 09:56:59 am

Japanese restaurants do have the aquired taste Natto but call to make sure. Japan uses nature appropriately. This product worked on my swollen right ankle in 12 hours & also use Mangosteen powder with meals & Spirulina powder 10pm. Feel great at 62yrs old with type1 Diabetes.

John link

9/10/2020 12:43:39 pm

Hi JJ,

To be honest, I am not entirely familiar with the effects of DMSO, so you may want to give it a good trial run and see if it provides you any benefit.

As far as a dosage (and this goes for any product really), I can't recommend a dosage that is beyond what is recommended on the bottle. When it comes to enzymes, your body is going to use what it needs and then flush the rest.

It has been shown that serrapeptase does not need to be "enteric coated." We actually sell a form of serrapeptase that is not and it is highly effective. The product is called Serretia, from Arthur Andrew Medical, and it uses a proprietary encapsulation that acts like an enteric coating, but made with cellulose (the main component of veggie caps). You can read more about it here:
https://www.swnutra.com/blog/acid-armor-vs-enteric-coating

Hope that helps!

9/10/2020 01:03:30 pm

Yes, The DMSO was of benefit... I just worry about it accentuating the effects/power of the nattokinase or lumbrokinase...
DMSO is said ti be a strong clot-buster in its own right.

The acid stuff was interesting... thx!

9/10/2020 04:51:06 pm

Hi, John, another question... I read that 1-2 glasses of red wine help thin the blood and help prevent clot formation.
Sounds great, I love the stuff... I until recently drank a glass of red wine with lunch... 6-8oz only.
think it would interact/reduce effectiveness of nattokinase?
thx!

John link

9/11/2020 09:26:59 am

Alcohol in general will thin blood, but as long as it is used in moderation, it should not have much of an effect, if any, with the effectiveness of a nattokinase supplement.

9/11/2020 09:59:51 am

That is great news... I really enjoyed my small glass of red with lunch...

I found what seems to be a good Naturopathic Doctor (NMD) he spent 40 minutes with me to sort of get to know each other before committing... think a regular Doc would? Jeeze. He knows about nattokinase, etc... so might be a good fit.

BTW: I just found out my sensitive estradiol was really low, 8.5... but a friend said that Lab Corp sensitive estradiol is known to be wildly inaccurate... jeeze again! I'll be re-tested soon, regular not sensitive, but the red wine is supposed to mildly up the estrogen... YAY!

Jon d telford

9/11/2023 06:59:28 am

You people are taking tiny doses of nattokinase, I am taking ten capsules of Arthur Andrews neprinol plus 28,000 Fus of nattokinase per day to clear out my clogged arteries.

Brian Moala

3/9/2021 07:50:38 am

Can you take Nattokinase and Horse Chestnut extract together

3/9/2021 08:39:25 am

I am not very familiar with Horse Chestnut, but since it seems to have blood thinning properties, I would not take with nattokinase... which also has blood thinning properties... depending on what you are trying to solve, I would consider lumbrokinase instead... I have not posted here for a while, but I switched to the Boluoke brand of lumbrokinase on the recommendation of my NMD, and with serrapeptase, it defeated my DVT (blood clot) in a bit more than 3 months... FAR better than warfarin or Eliquis would have done, without the risk.
BTW: If choosing only between horse chestnut and nattokinase, I would take the nattokinase... buy the NK-SD form, it is far superior.

Kat Andrews link

3/15/2021 09:59:56 pm

I have been taking Nato Kinase for 2 years now, I have been taking 2000 FU + K2 MK-7with Natokinase 100mcg and I just started to take Heal -n- SOOTHE byLiving well can you look at this product online and the ingrediants it's a systemic enzyme blend but I am worried about the product I take the Nato at bedtime and the heal and soothe 2 in the am and one more in the afternoon. But I am wondering if together with the Nato is it safe because the Heal & soothe has got also blood thinning properties in it. I had auto accident in 2018 and have had pain ever since. So that is why I am taking the the Heal & soothe. Today is the 2nd day on it and it already is helping. can you e-mail me back. Thanks so much Kat

3/16/2021 08:29:15 am

Hi, Kat, I think the only thing in your heal n soothe that thins blood is ginger. IMO, that stuff is WAY overpriced... I recommend buying Devil's claw and bromelain individually ( I use Swansons or Ebay)... and adding 40-80,000 spu serrapeptase to that mix, empty stomach... then you save a ton... get a stronger dose of both the DC and Brom, and don't get the ginger... and add a great anti-inflammatory and healer in serrapeptase.
Avoid aspirin too. Ibuprophen should be OK... only if you really need it.
I am not a MD, so just my opinions. Hope they help!

Michael

5/15/2021 03:37:36 am

I have a family history of heart disease and a coronary calcium scan show some build up on the left side. My blood pressure is also high. I’ve been working on my diet and fasting for 18 hours daily. Around 16 hours into the fast I take 8,000 fu of Nattokinase in hopes that it will help my arteries. Is there any negative to taking this in a fasted state?

5/15/2021 07:14:52 am

I am not a Doctor... but... IMO...I think Nattokinase is supposed to be taken on an empty stomach, otherwise it becomes an expensive digestive enzyme... fasting means empty stomach, so no problem.
I would recommend adding at least 40,000SPU of Serrapeptase to your daily protocol...
IF you are taking ANY sort of blood thinners, prescription or otherwise (aspirin, turmeric, ginger, etc)... check with your doctor, though most traditional MDs don't know squat about enzymes or most non-Big Pharma treatments... I have a good naturopathic MD (NMD), really helps.

Glenn

9/9/2021 09:15:25 am

Thanks for all of your helpful comments. Can you tell me who your naturopath is? I want to clear my arteries but am confused by how much of what to take etc. Thanks

Bruce winter

9/9/2021 12:58:26 pm

Glenn, I don't have a naturopath I do my own research. I take natto miso which was in supermarkets in Hawaii. Now a friend ships me a box every few months. No problem being room temp for a few days. Or probably longer.

9/9/2021 01:12:38 pm

Sure, Glenn... again, I am not a doctor, so this is not medical advice... but it depends, IMO, on the amount of clogging you currently have in your arteries... your Cardiologist should be able to do tests to tell you that... for MY blood clot/DVT... I took up to two 20mg Lumbrokinase (Blouoke brand) three time/day... and 80,000 SPU of Serrapeptase daily... always on empty stomach... and waited 30-60 minutes after before eating. That was for a serious, even life threatening condition... for maintenance now, I take one 20mg lumbrokinase (either Boluoke or Doctors Best brand) twice a day... and 40,000-80,000 SPU Serrapeptase daily... it is important, IMO to buy enteric coated products.
I have not taken either natto or nattokinase, as the above mix worked so well for me.
As an aside... I am hoping these enzymes also will mitigate the damage that the Covid "vaccines" afflict the bodies of the poor vaxxed can do... I am not vaxxed, but the vaxxed shed the spike proteins, so it is still a concern.
GL to you!

glenn

9/10/2021 05:48:22 am

hi j.j. thanks for your reply - in your above post you said you have a good naturopath m.d. i was wondering if i could have his/her name & contact info. many thanks

9/10/2021 08:52:07 am

Oops! His name is Dr. Jorge Cochran NMD in Tucson, 520-546-3233 he now works with a NP that can prescribe drugs that he cannot. GL to you!

Susan

6/7/2021 06:46:24 am

Good day.
I take 100mg Nattokinase and 80,000 of Serapeptase on empty stomach.
I also take Qucertin, ubiniquol and digestive enzymes and the usual multi cal/mag D, B complex.
Is this ok to take on daily basis or am I just wasting my money with some.
Eg: when reading about Nattokinase it seems to also have alot of vitamins and minerals in it plus protein?.
Do i need multivitamins etc too ?
I would hate to be taking unnecessary supplements.

Thank you.
Susan.

6/7/2021 07:00:44 am

Hello, Susan,
I think 100mg Nattokinase daily is a good maintenance dosage, though I prefer Lumbrokinase, as I have had a DVT previously and Lumbrokinase is a much stronger "clot dissolver/preventative"
I sometimes take 40,000 Serrapeptase, sometimes 80,000, usually only 40,000.
I do not think nattokinase has enough vitamins or protein to preclude you taking a multi. I would NOT recommend supplementing calcium, but taking at least 5,000iu of D3 daily... your multi should contain enough B-complex. Most good multis require 2-3 pills daily, taken at different times (meals?). I recommend extra magnesium and boron.
Quercetin is a good supplement, but gives me side effects. Ubiquinol is great, especially if you take a statin drug. I prefer taking Bergamot extract to a statin. Digestive enzymes are fine.
All this just my non-MD opinion!

Michelle Kauler

8/1/2021 05:23:10 pm

Is it ok to take Nattokinase as we as olive leaf extract?

8/1/2021 06:12:14 pm

I am no Doc... but I doubt they would interact... BUT... I recommend not taking them at the same time... all such enzymes as nattokinase should be taken on an empty stomach... alone.

Don't waste the enzymatic action on the Olive Leaf extract. Allow it to work on the BAD stuff!

Bradley

8/2/2021 04:15:23 pm

What JJ said is good advice...There aren't any known interactions between the two, but always best to take enzyme supplements (unless it's a digestive enzyme supplement) away from foods and other such dietary products. Doing this will increase the efficiency and absorption of both the nattokinase and the olive leaf extract. All the best!

Vera Osborn

8/9/2021 01:32:52 pm

I suffered a stroke in 2017. I've been on several BP medicines, none of which helped, just made my pressure go very low and caused me dizziness and I was unable to function. I got off of them and now taking Hawthorne berry. But, I need something else to manage my pressure. It goes up to 175/64, and I that's not good. Can take Nattokinaise? I'm 85 yrs old and generally very healthy.

8/9/2021 01:52:03 pm

I am not a doctor... keep that in mind... I would assume you are on blood thinners... so nattokinase may not be a great fit... or serrapeptase... if NOT on blood thinners, they IMO, would be helpful. I think lumbrokinase might do you a lot of good... it supposedly doesn't have the bleeding risk that the others do...
My father was helped a lot by going on an old style BP med... Hytrin... I'd start a 1 mg and ramp up slowly after monitoring your BP closely. You may well have been given too strong of a dose of the others... that is common.
If your pipes are clogged (have them checked if you have not already)... serrapeptase is great, but again. careful if you are on blood thinners...
BTW: Are you scared of having your BP taken now? I am, and often get high readings like yours when in a Doc's office or am anxious... but when at home and relaxed... totally normal, even a little lower... take yours at home with a wrist cuff... often... btw: That 64 diastolic is great! Again, do your homework, I am NOT an MD!

Vera Osborn

8/9/2021 04:36:47 pm

I am not on blood thinners. My doctor put me HCTZ 12.5mg and Simvastatin 20mg. That made my pressure after a time, very low. I stayed on Simvastatin for my Cholesterol. I was then put on Losartan 50mg/ HCTZ 12.5mg. At first it worked very well, my BP was consistent for a while. Then it started going very low, and I was having the same problem again. So I stopped taking anything, except Hawthorn Blend. I don't feel dizzy but sometimes I feel lightheaded. But that doesn't normalize my BP. I know I should take something because I get a pain in the left side of my head below my ear. It comes and goes. My Blood workup has been very good. I have to keep my pressure under control because I have high pressure in my eye, for which I use eyedrops. (Cataracts removed) I know you are not a doctor, but can you just tell me, can I possibly benefit from Nattokinaise?

Zan

1/31/2023 09:36:26 am

There are people who took Olive leaf extract 750mg 2 to 3 times a day and it kept their bp under control

8/9/2021 04:54:09 pm

The Hydrochlorothiazide (HCTZ) could cause low BP, if you got to a point that you did not need a diuretic anymore... was your use monitored closely?
The Simvastatin should not have had a major effect either way on your BP... it is a cholesterol med... a Statin, not a BP med.
I would ask your Doc about starting low dose Lisinopril or Hytrin, as I mentioned before... especially if you have consistently high BP... Nattokinase is great, but IMO, will not solve your BP issues in the short or mid-term... it is great for unclogging the veins and arteries over time, which will effect BP positively... I would add in Serrapeptase, which dose similar things, but is a great inflammation reducer and plaque remover... over time...
For now, I would get on low-dose Lisinopril or Hytrin... if the first one gives you problems, switch, but under the supervision of your cardiologist... beginning on low dose should not give you the bad side effects or too low BP... meanwhile, the Nattokinase/Serrapeptase can be working on cleaning your "pipes".
All just my non-medical opinions!! Unfortunately, most "mainstream" MDs know nothing of enzymes like Nattokinase or serrapeptase.

jan gridley

10/1/2021 08:13:51 pm

My husband had a ischemic stroke recently. He took a prescription blood thinner for 90 days along with aspirin. Now that he's off blood thinner & aspirin, we are trying nattokinaise. 1 in a.m & 2 bedtime. Problem is he refuses to give up his 6 oz. Of milk at bedtime. Will that negate the natto's effectiveness.

10/1/2021 08:34:30 pm

Hmmmmm... again, I am NOT a doctor, so do your own research... but... I am surprised that your husband was taken off blood thinners after only 90 days... I would HOPE that was due to them confirming his blood clot was completely gone? Perhaps his stroke was "provoked" and the risk is now gone? Unlikely...
Still I would have thought they would keep him on low dose something for a lot longer than 3 months...
The main thing about Nattokinase or the other enzymes is that they need to be taken on an empty stomach... so simply tell him to work around the Nattokinase and the milk... I'd prefer waiting an hour (30 minutes at least) after the Nattokinase dose before eating (or drinking anything but water, coffee or tea)... and two hours AFTER eating/drinking anything is when to take the Nattokinase.
I think Nattokinase would be fine... and effective... but I prefer taking lumbrokinase and serrapeptase instead... Lumbrokinase is a far stronger clot (fibrin) dissolver than nattokinase... but either way should be effective.
If he (and you) are vaxxed... the clotting risk rises significantly, from all that I have read... so taking either the nattokinase or a prescription blood thinner might be even more important... is it possible the stroke was a vaxx side effect?

jan gridley

1/10/2022 03:45:15 pm

No, he's not vaxxed, doesn't intend to. What brand of lumbrokinase do you recommend?

1/10/2022 04:34:01 pm

I took Boluoke brand Lumbrokinase, but I think Dr's Best is probably just fine, and much less.
I use Serra-Rx brand serrapeptase... Dr's Best might even be better...

Good for him on refusing the clot-shot!

Lakhwinder

11/8/2021 08:38:45 pm

Can u take nattokianse and probiotic together before go to bed.

Bradley

11/9/2021 02:18:45 pm

Prior to bedtime is a good time to take supplements like these because they are generally recommended to be taken away from food. I am not aware of any interactions between the two.

11/9/2021 02:39:16 pm

Nattokinase needs to be taken on an empty stomach... I don't know about combining with probiotics, but I wouldn't...

I think 30 minutes min before or after.... JMHO

5/17/2022 12:20:14 pm

I have a hard time swallowing capsules. Can I open up the nattokinase and mix it into some liquid and take it that way?

Thank You!

John link

5/23/2022 02:30:15 pm

Hi RK,

The short answer to your question is yes, you can pull apart the capsules if you have a hard time swallowing them. However, there are two things to note when doing this.

It won't taste good at all. I recommend adding the contents to a flavored beverage or yogurt to help disguise the taste.

Second, anytime that you open up the capsules, you are going to be taking away from the effectiveness and absorbability of the product. The capsules help to protect the contents from the digestive process so that as many of the enzymes can get to where they need to go in the body. People do this all the time though...these are just some things to be aware of. Hope that helps and makes sense.

Best of luck!

Deedee

11/28/2021 08:19:08 am

What is the big difference between lumbrokinase and nattokinase? Every time I have been vaccinated my d dimer goes up which is terrifying. Is this due to the spike protein and what is that relationship to clotting? The rest of my blood tests are ok, and I actually git a CT scan after the 1st vaccine and all was fine. It does cause great anxiety and eventually, it does resolve itself. Trying to figure out how much nattikonase to take and if U should switch to lumbrokinase. Earth worms?? I also take 1-3 g of fish oil and curcumin. Both are said to help to thin blood. I have high BP and noticed to recommend lisinopril. Why lisnopril? Why Hytrin? The side effects from BP meds have horrific. Got tachy cardia from htz because can’t keep hydrated because any liquid I drink is quickly removed. I and this vaccine also has its issues. Trying to balance it all out.

11/28/2021 09:16:06 am

I am NOT a Doctor... but have done a lot of reading on these enzymes...
I used Lumbrokinase (Boluoke brand) to defeat a serious DVT in 3 months, and took no Eliquis or warfarin (my doctors all went bananas)... do your own research... what I have found might not fit YOUR situation... I think nattokinase is a great every day supplement for many things... I have been on lumbrokinase (LK) daily since my DVT in 9/20, but might switch to Nattokinase (NK) as my DVT was likely "provoked" by testosterone replacement therapy... I do have, supposedly, Leiden V, a clotting disorder, so this is serious stuff for me... I have been also taking Serrapeptase with the Lumbrokinase daily, 40000 to 80000 daily. Personally, I would not combine LK with NK... but would take serrapeptase with either. I think NK benefits more overall than LK, but LK is MUCH stronger in terms of dissolving fibrin/blood clots...
Yes, I would for sure be concerned about the "vaccines" causing blood clotting... VERY concerned... perhaps a combo of LK and Serrapeptase would be appropriate for you, a Naturopathic MD knowledgeable about these enzymes would be a worthy investment. I would not take aspirin with NK. From online articles:

The most unique feature of NK is that, as a single compound, it possesses multiple CVD preventative and alleviating pharmacologic effects (namely, antithrombotic, antihypertensive, anticoagulant, anti-atherosclerotic, and neuroprotective effects). There are no other drugs or drug candidates with multiple pharmacologic properties similar to NK.Of all the proteolytic, or protein digesting enzymes, only serrapeptase and nattokinase come close to resembling lumbrokinase in terms of fibrinolytic activity.

However, lumbrokinase is “king” when it comes to strength, as it’s:

About 300-times stronger than serrapeptase, an enzyme extracted from silkworms.
Nearly 30-times stronger than nattokinase, the notorious enzyme extracted from natto, or traditional Japanese fermented soybeans.

Kristine

12/20/2021 07:25:43 pm

"Personally, I would not combine LK with NK... but would take serrapeptase with either."

I have seen people take LK with NK and am just wondering what your reasons are for not wanting to combine these two together?

Thanks

12/20/2021 08:51:37 pm

Remember, I am no Doc...

I think taking both might be overkill... I prefer lumbrokinase as it's :

"About 300-times stronger than serrapeptase, an enzyme extracted from silkworms.
Nearly 30-times stronger than nattokinase, the notorious enzyme extracted from natto, or traditional Japanese fermented soybeans.

Here’s something else that makes lumbrokinase stand apart from the others...

It has a built-in balancing mechanism that promotes both fibrinolysis and fibrinogenesis. That means it can both break down and build up fibrin, depending upon your body’s needs..."

Nattokinase, to my knowledge, does not have this balancing mechanism... so could cause too much blood thinning... for example, nattokinase and aspirin are not recommended together... and nattokinase has to be stopped well before any surgery...

I take serrapeptase too, for inflammation control and to keep my pipes clear... it eats arterial plaque. I take them at different times... some don't bother.

Kristine

12/21/2021 08:07:10 pm

Okay good points, thanks.

I was thinking of taking LK am, Serrapeptase in afternoon and NK at night.

That way, covering all bases as they are all just a bit different and may have different helpful mechanisms.

I agree though that LK is the winner of them all, if I had to limit to one.

Thanks

Jay

1/9/2022 07:27:00 am

Started 100mg NK. I noticed that the multi/v I’m taking has high E in it. 67mg of d alpha tocopherol succinate. Any cause for concern, or just lower the dosage of the synthetic E ?

Maurits de vries

2/11/2022 03:05:03 am

I take one Natto capsule everymorning on a empty stomach, and right after that I take one glass of Diatomaceous earth. Now I`m wondering can the particles in the Diatomaceous earth harm the enzymes? or is that not possible?

2/11/2022 08:42:29 am

I think taking the DE right after the natto (you meant nattokinase?) capsule would completely negate any benefit... IMO, the DE would absorb the nattokinase or prevent its absorption. IF you really mean natto, not nattokinase, that would be even more likely to be rendered useless.

I recommend taking them at least an hour apart, both on empty stomach, better yet, take at different times of day. I take DE before bed.

JMHO

Maurits de vries

2/11/2022 01:17:05 pm

Thank you for your comments

I mean indeed natto kinaso supplements and not natto

Debbie Gonzalez

2/16/2022 09:08:19 pm

Hi there,
I am hoping you might be able to tell me if taking 60,000 total FU (of a combo) nattokinase and serrepeptase is okay to do (2 in morning 2 later in afternoon) along with a 325mg asprin?

The reason I took the asprin, this evening, was because I felt my hand starting to be tingly; this prompted me to do the asprin for microblood clot concerns....

I believe I am suffering my 5th round of covid... I am unvaxed.

Thank you for your thoughts!

2/25/2022 06:51:52 pm

i have enjoyed everyone's honest opinion and sharing of their medical condition me personally i had a lung embolism blood clotting and had some clots removed but after 6 months of taking Eliquis 5mg 2x a day they have not dissolved the clots and the problem with the medical community they are trained to give you a prescription that may or may not work and more importantly cause you more harm so now i am on my own quest to find solutions to my own condition and it has been helpful in hearing from you all even though we are not doctors we can at least give our honest opinions and i sincerely thank you all especially you JJ because you let me see that i am on the right track.

2/26/2022 08:40:23 am

My pleasure, RT, I am glad you are going in the right direction. It is sad that Cardiologists do not recommend Lumbrokinase along with drugs like Eliquis (which do nothing to dissolve a clot)... but... if they keep your clot in place, very slowly dissolving... they make far more PROFIT.

I wish you well...

T.S.

3/27/2022 12:59:57 pm

I'm old. (83) In my past I've had BOTH corotid arteries surgically scrapped out. Both ops were a success. I have no complaint concerning the surgeon nor the ops themselves. I've also had one heart attack resulting in a stent. (not medicated) I used to smoke and as a result Mr. Emphysema knows my name. But that was then and back then I knew NOTHING of serrapeptase nor nattokinase. If I did I would have taken steps to prevent a reoccurrence. However, I am showing symptoms from ALL 3 areas telling me the crud is back. At my age I am NOT a good surgical risk. (Not that I would.) Here's my plan of action: (Due to my schedule I can only carve out 2 "time windows.") When I wake: 250,000 IU serrapeptase and 2000 FU nattokinase. I repeat the procedure every 12 hours thereafter. If anyone has any suggestions toward a better plan I'm all ears. Thank you.

3/27/2022 01:25:27 pm

You plan seems sound... personally, I would exchange nattokinase for lumbrokinase... the strong dosage of both serrapeptase and nattokinase might thin the blood (anticoagulant anti platelet action) a bit too much... and lumbrokinase is many times stronger than nattokinase. I recommend no aspirin if you stick with your plan and don't switch.
I would also recommend, for overall health improvement, researching Dr. Kalcker's work with Chlorine Dioxide Solution (CDS)... on Bitchute, not the censorship monster and Big Pharma shill Youtube... I do not recommend MMS at all. Both demonized, but that is likely due to Big Pharma worrying about their profits. I have taken for a month+ and it has helped a lot, and no side effects.
GL to you and blah blah, this is not medical advice. ;-)

Russ

4/3/2022 08:45:01 am

I was recently diagnosed with Afib and have had one additional episode over a 5 month period of time. Prior to this I did have a brain stroke 14 years ago. I am now 75. I was maintained an Plavix following the stroke with no side effects. After the Afib diagnosis I was told to stop the Plavix and prescribed Eliquis. I could not tolerate Eliquis with many side effects. In the meantime, after talking with my local pharmacist, he suggested I try a quality Nattokinase (DaVinci Labs). I take one 150 mg a day with absolutely no side effects.

Now, my cardiologist is recommending I take Xeralto. I have taken Xeralto in the past due to a blood clot in my leg and the bleeding side effects were significant.

I know you are not a doctor as I am just looking for another opinion.

My question is this: considering the recent diagnosis of Afib, and the Nattokinase I now take, should I also take the Xeralto and just tolerate the bleeding side effects (bleeding when brushing teeth, blood under skin on arms)? Taking both ok?

4/3/2022 11:54:55 am

Well... unfortunately Afib is really tough to treat naturally... beyond any expertise I may have... I will say though... that nattokinase and serrapeptase, especially together, like in your DaVinci supplement (a good one, IMO) can cause blood thinning... when combined with a prescription blood thinner/anticoagulant,,, it might be too much... I worry about a hemorrhagic stroke... make darn sure your MD (and pharmacist) knows about you taking them together... I bet he says NO.
Look into lumbrokinase, it does not have the potential bleeding side effects that nattokinase and serrapeptase have, serrapeptase much less that nattokinase... and may help you to knock out mini-clots if they form.
I really dislike prescription blood thinners, especially Eliquis, but all are nasty drugs... with Afib, though... your options are so limited... perhaps your MD will reduce the dosage of Xarelto if he is OK with you taking your DaVinci supplement... IF you can handle a strict diet... warfarin may be a better option with less side effects... BTW: Dabigatran or Pradaxa get far better reviews than Xarelto, which gets worse reviews than even Eliquis...
Get your exercise, move to a strongly anti-inflammatory diet, avoid aspirin... they say Yoga helps (jeeze!)... I sure wish you well...

Lark

8/9/2022 08:23:02 am

Wow! First I’m glad I found you. Long post. Had atrial tachycardia for about 17 years treated successfully with flecinide. (I think it was a result of fosamax). Had a heart attack in 8/20. Stent in LAD. Treated with statin (which I stopped) and Brilinta with low dose aspirin. Stopped those about 11 months later. Got Covid on 11/2/21 had second heart attack on 11/17/21. Treated in ER with TNKase. Was given Brilinta with aspirin, entresto (switched to Losartin, farxiga, statin. Awful side effects. I’ve stopped all except Brilinta and aspirin. Doctor and NP would not listen. Brought in all of my supplements, D-Ribose, CoQ10, nattokinase, cholesterol complete, Mag, taurine, etc., neither one of them would even look at the bottles. Had LOTS I’d palpitations, which I told them about repeatedly. Wire the Zio. They saw everything (SVTs and one AFib) and referred me to EP for discussion of ablation. He is changing my meds from Brilinta to Eliquis due to the one AFib episode (feel like it’s a death sentence). Have not started E. Recommended another ECHO before moving forward. Not jabbed. See an acupuncturist, DC, and reflexologist routinely. Just did a liver/gallbladder cleanse. (They thought I had hepatitis and sent me for an ultrasound and discovered the gallstones, which, of course, can only be resolved with surgery. Please advise! Thank you. Thank you.

8/9/2022 11:11:15 am

I wish I could be of help to you... you have a lot going on, and my level of expertise is simply not adequate to advise you... you need a great cardiologist and a great naturopathic MD (NMD), probably also consult with a vascular surgeon and lipid specialist.

I am a big fan of the enzymes discussed here... and also a substance called Chlorine Dioxide Solution (CDS) Look up a video by Dr. kalcker, the foremost expert on CDS called "CDS for newbies". Interesting!! It may solve a lot of problems... but do your homework and consult with good people!!

JFit link

9/6/2022 10:26:04 pm

Hello JJ, I read your comments on Nattokinase, Lumbrokinase, and Serrapeptase. I've been in the healthcare field for some 27 years with a specialty in clinical exercise physiology and functional integrative medicine. I am very familiar with proteolytic enzymes but I have personally not tried them up until a month ago. I was on TRT and one other prescription drug called Tadalafil. I was taking both and turned out the Tadalafil was a mistake. I had a low blood flow stroke due to taking the 5mg daily Tadalafil. Had the stroke in April 2022 and it basically effected coordination on my right side. I'm about 90% back to normal, but it was scary for sure. The concluded it was the Tadalafil because every major artery and blood vessel was clean as a whistle. 0% plaque according to the scans. My heart is perfect and I had a neural scan done last month and the docs said my brain was performing better than the average healthy adult so I am very grateful. Anyways, after the stroke I stopped the TRT cold turkey and of course stopped the Tadalafil. All my clotting factors and everything else related to clotting and inflammation came back completely normal. My BP averages 110/70 and sometimes in the mornings it would be as low as 95/60 and this is why I was not a good candidate for taking a vasodilator because when I stood up from my desk after sitting for 90 minutes that morning, I stroked out immediately. Horrible! On the day of my stroke my hemoglobin was 15.9 and my hematocrit was 48% so docs didn't think anything of it. I've always been a little concerned about elevated hematocrit, but with exercise and hydration it helps keep things flowing. I was just curious if you knew what your hematorcrit numbers were when you were diagnosed with your blood clots? Have you noticed any difference in decreased hematocrit since taking the lumbrokinase/serrapeptase. I have all 3 and been taking nattokinase religiously the past few weeks and I am doing blood work tomorrow. Was just curious if you have seen it lower hematocrit? Oh, I never got vaxxed either because something deep down told me to not do it. Yes, I got ridiculed for it and had to do telemedicine from home, but so glad I didn't follow the rest of my colleagues because now there is a lot of talk about funeral directors and embalmers finding strange strands of clots in people so much so that they are unable to drain the blood without getting backflow into their systems. I've also had friends who have serious side effects from the vax. One was perfectly healthy and had a stroke 2 weeks after his second shot. BTW, I am 58 years of age with ZERO underlying medical issues and I just started back on TRT last week. Injecting 15mg daily since that dose before was getting my total T up in the 1100 range and free T in the mid 200s. Thanks for any feedback!

9/8/2022 11:44:33 am

I think your Doc made a mistake giving you the Tadalafil if your BP was low-normal... consider consulting an attorney... I tried that drug and it gave me many issues too... very rapid heart rate... scary... anxiety, brain fog...
Be careful with nattokinase, it caused MY BP to go too low... 90/52... which is why I went back to Lumbrokinase... plus, I have histamine intolerance and MCAS, and nattokinase is usually from a fermented source...
My hematocrit was normal before my DVT... it wasn't checked after... I did find out I had Leiden V, which the Docs should have tested for prior, but I find these days most Docs are Big Pharma stooges and are there to prescribe their poisons, not to really diagnose and treat anymore... TRT can provoke a clot in several ways, raising hematocrit is just one...
Lumbrokinase should reduce hematocrit, but if yours is normal... might not be much difference...
Yes, I didn't take the death-jab either, lucky to be into alternative news sources... most MSM is still pushing the jabs, even though the numbers of people dead and disabled is growing fast and is already appalling... it WILL get worse... clotting and dementia are slow to get to the levels of major problems... we are entering that time-frame now...
Glad you are doing much better... I would still be wary of TRT...

Mena mary baldeosingh

11/28/2022 12:43:37 am

Hi I just saw these comments here and I wish I can get some info on taking. NATTOKINASE. CAN WE CONTACT BY MAIL? Thank you so much.

Spurzo

12/4/2022 04:39:57 am

What’s the effective dose of Nattokinase to dissolve block clots and fibrin?

Right now I’m taking 2000 fu in the morning. I also take 4 g fish oil, 2400 mg garlic extract, 200 IU Vitamin E, 240 mg ginkgo biloba per day away from nattokinase . And I also take 81 mg aspirin at night.

12/4/2022 08:23:49 am

First, I am no Doctor... but IMO... if you know you have a clot, Lumbrokinase is 30X stronger in dissolving clots/fibrin than nattokinase. IF you do not... then nattokinase 2000FU is a good preventive for clots and vascular health.
I would check in with a naturopath, if you are able... as IMO, you are taking in a LOT of blood thinning supplements daily... perhaps too many. You CAN get too much of a good thing... and increase your risk of a hemorrhagic stroke or other bleeding problem...

Amanda Bullock

1/1/2023 10:28:39 pm

Wow what an informative site! So glad I found it.
Currently on 10 mg xarelto for a DVT in left leg. I had to ask for a lower dose from dr and am determined to get off them completely. Currently taking Nattokinase in am empty stomach and 60000 serrapeptase daily. After reading thru these comments I might switch out the natto for the lumbrokinase.
I also take quercetin, vitamin d, methyl, resveratrol, ginkgo biloba, a multivitamin, glutathione, burdock root, and NAC- does this all seem like too much? Thanks so much!

1/2/2023 02:21:15 pm

Again, I am not a MD and do not offer any advice... but for only myself... I wonder, did you tell your doctors about all the stuff you are taking? Seems to be a LOT, considering you have added several blood thinners on top of the anti-coagulant. Do you have a CURRENT DVT?? Where is it located?
Lumbrokinase is 30X stronger in dissolving clots than nattokinase, and has less effect on coagulation, some say none. Serrapeptase does thin blood, but much less than nattokinase. I hope you are not taking aspirin with all that stuff...
I admit, I am not a fan of MDs these days, most are Big Pharma tools. Maybe find yourself a good naturopathic MD (NMD), even if you have to tele-conference.
You might ask if staying on low-dose Xarelto for a while, and adding lumbrokinase (I used Boluoke, but Drs Best may be OK for much less... though if I had a current DVT, I would spend the big bucks)... maybe keep the serrapeptase for pain, inflammation and a few extra benefits...
But remember... you need to consult with a pro... who has experience with enzymes... I have only my own research and experience with my DVT, which was one leg, just above the knee to the ankle... far less of a threat than a DVT that is much higher up... Remember, I used topical 70/30 99.995% pure DMSO gel on my leg too... I think that helped, perhaps a lot. GL to you!

Amanda Bullock

1/2/2023 02:44:45 pm

Thanks for your comments JJ. Yes I do have a kickass naturopath ever since I got my DVT last March. It was most likely from the vaxx due to timing and no other logical reason drs could find. I am despising drs and big pharma right now as well which is why I am doing a lot of research on natural methods to dissolve and keep the clots away. My DVT was lower leg and was quite long. I will request another ultrasound this March at 1 year to see if it is still present. If it is gone I will likely request to be off xarelto and move to just enzyme and supplement maintenance.
Thanks again for the site and the answers you provide to everyone!

Lucy

1/11/2023 06:44:20 am

I want to to Nattokinase on a long term basis for all of its benefits but mainly because of its ability to attack the spike protein in acute covid. When I take it on an empty stomach I get migraines so it benefits me much more to take capsules with food but now I fear I’m wasting its potential. Please note I’m not too bothered about taking it for blood clotting issues even though I do have a post-viral chronic illness that came along before covid

1/11/2023 08:00:04 am

Yes, IMO, taking nattokinase with food pretty much turns it into a digestive enzyme and cancels out most or all of its intended benefits. I don't take nattokinase because it gives me some side effects, probably because it comes from fermented substance... and I have histamine intolerance issues... perhaps you do too.
Also, Lumbrokinase is far more powerful than nattokinase, so you might want to give it a try... I have not had any problems with it, and always take on an empty stomach. I take serrapeptase too, same way, no problems.
For that post-viral illness, I would look into Ivermectin, D3 and Zinc.
Keep in mind, I am not a Doc and do not offer medical advice. GL!! ;-)

LINDA M STEWART link

1/15/2023 03:39:57 pm

I was taking Lumbrokinse for high LP(a). It did lower my numbers but not to within the normal range. I just had a calcium scoring done on my heart and scored a zero. I just switched to Nattokinase by Orthomolecular Products. Not sure if it will help. I did notice in the thread that said not to take Nattokinase with a calcium supplement. I do have osteopenia so I think I need a calcium supplement. Thanks so much.
Linda

1/15/2023 04:07:37 pm

Hi, Linda... I know it is boring, but remember, I am not a Doc and do not offer medical advice... but if it were me, I'd congratulate myself on that zero Calcium CT score!! (Mine was zero last time too, so I did!)... I would take 2-3 grams of liposomal vitamin C daily, in split doses and take Lysine with each dose. Also a couple of cups of coffee, if you tolerate it well, carnatine, vitamin e (mixed tocopherols and tocotrienols) and a good EPA fish oil supplement. Also I suggest a low carb diet.

With your zero Cal CT score, I would not get too nervous... especially if your LDL score is normal... and I think enzyme supplements will go a long way to avoid the increased clotting risk that lipo(a) brings... though I have not read that clotting risk is a big factor in elevated lipo(a)... I prefer Lumbrokinase and serrapeptase, but if you prefer nattokinase... OK.
I would not take calcium for osteopenia, in fact, IMO, it is dangerous... though many MDs recommend it... ( I am not a big fan of most MDs)... I think taking vitamin K2(Mk7) and D3 is a far better idea.

This sure is getting to be a long thread!! I hope some others will jump in and give their opinions and responses to questions... ;-)

Sharon R Byrne

4/16/2023 06:52:47 am

Hi, was reading through your site. Such a great job! I think lipo a is not a problem it is lipo b that will cause clotting. There is a test that can be done to find your profile whether you are lipoa or b. Also after 60 yo an increase in lipo a is a good indicator of longer life span in most people.

4/16/2023 07:43:07 am

Sharon Byrne: I think you are confused... High levels of Lipo(a) is indeed a BAD thing, ask any knowledgeable cardiologist... here is an article that may clear it up for you:

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/lipoprotein-a-what-it-is-test-results-and-what-they-mean

You are also confusing, I think, Lipo (b) with Apo b, or Apolipoprotein B... which is also a very BAD thing to have high levels of. (Lipo b is an injectible, used for weight loss sometimes) Here is an article that will clear THAT up for you:

https://labs.selfdecode.com/blog/apolipoprotein-b/

I hope this helps.

Rachel Bettenson

1/17/2023 02:01:18 am

Very impressed with the info on this site. I'm looking for help for my 32 yr old son who had the shot and now has blood clots near his heart and constant left side pain. Not much for specialists and doctors in our isolated area so I'm looking for info on helping him naturally.

1/17/2023 08:44:23 am

Very sorry to hear... how did you find out he had clots near the heart and what doctor told you this... and what did they recommend/prescribe? If clots near the heart were found, I would have thought your son would (should) be in a hospital...
I recommend contacting a good Naturopathic Doctor, you can do tele-appointments... if you do not have one locally, you might do a consultation with Dr. Jerry Taylor in MT... (406) 265-2250. I believe he is knowledgeable about enzymes, not sure if he recommends one of MY favorites, chlorine dioxide solution (CDS).
If this was me... (not medical advice), Ivermectin, lumbrokinase, serrapeptase, CDS, EPA fish oil, quercetin or rutin, l-citrulline, magnesium glycinate... possibly internal DMSO... but consulting a doctor for this serious situation is a must. GL to you both!

3/1/2023 06:11:45 pm

cancel that Ivermectin recommendation... I found that is MIGHT be problematic.

Elaine HORTON-BENNETT

1/19/2023 06:24:10 pm

WOW...LOVING THIS THREAD! So much knowledge and experience. I have worked in Natural Health field for many years. I have become a follower of Anthony Williams who is followed by millions. I have adopted some of his protocols and recommendations with great improvements. I have developed a DVT to the left of mt knee...with discolouration circuling my knee. I have tried high dose Serrapeptase (250iu) with some success with surrounding vein inflammation. I have been on 2 x 2000fu Nattokinase caps at bedtime for 5 days with an improvement. Based on all IMO advice...going to swop Nattokinese for Lumberkinese because of my DVT. So my question is (finally) A. Williams (aka Medical Medium) highly recommends NOT taking any fish oils (filled with heavy metals even those claimed to be 'CLEAN' and to obtain Omega three from Algae. Any thoughts please?

Yoke Wong

1/30/2023 08:29:15 pm

Is it safe to eat Nattokinese while I am also on statin to lower cholesterol? Thank you.

1/31/2023 12:01:31 pm

I am not a Doc and do not offer medical advice... but if it were me, I would ask for a C-reactive protein and Lipo(a) test before taking any statin... unless my total and LDL numbers were above 250+ and 130+ respectively... even then, if my C-rp and Lipo(a) numbers were normal... I'd try to solve via diet changes and taking Bergamot, EPA fish oil, plant sterols, maybe guggul.
IF I was really concerned, I would request a cardiac Calcium CT scan, fine out if your coronary arteries are clogging up.
I know of no interaction between statins and nattokinase, but ask a naturopath... regular MDs usually know zero about enzymes.
IF I were ever to take a statin, it would be 5mg Crestor generic (rosuvastatin) and get re-checked in a few months. AND take Co-Q10 with it.
IMO, cholesterol problems are related to INFLAMMATION, far more than cholesterol levels... unless those levels are very high. That is indicated in the C-RP blood test. Some like the Homocysteine test too.

1/31/2023 12:04:13 pm

Sorry... inflammation is indicated by the C-RP and homocysteine tests, cholesterol levels are indicated by the usual tests.

I was not clear and there is no EDIT button!

2/4/2023 07:04:44 pm

Even though my cholesterol is under 200, my LDL-p is over 1500 which is very high. My calcium score is 0 but I'm worried about soft plaque and clots. My CRP is 2.97. This thread has been so helpful and it seems like SK would be my best option. Do you agree? Should I add the LK or do you think the SK is enough? I take 5mg rosuvastatin and coq10 ubiquinol.

2/4/2023 07:24:27 pm

I also have a zero Calcium CT score, at least back in '17... maybe time for another. I also have a very high small particle count, around 1900... probably genetic. I am not that concerned about it, though I sure wish it was lower. The articles below may make you feel better, they did me. Your C-rp score is a bit high, but with a zero Cal.ct score... I wouldn't worry much... maybe make some changes in your diet, sugar is the devil, get more exercise, etc... the serrapeptase should help a lot, taking the rosuvastatin should have your LDL low or at least normal. maybe ask for a Lipo(a) blood test, if that is low... good stuff... seems like you are doing fine, adding some LK would not hurt... only help... JMHO... BTW, don't ever rely on MY opinions ;-).

https://jeffreydachmd.com/2018/02/ldl-cholesterol-particle-size-and-number-what-gives/

https://www.medindia.net/news/healthwatch/soft-or-hard-plaque-which-poses-greater-risk-of-heart-attack-168735-1.htm

3/1/2023 06:14:05 pm

Just an FYI to all... I think everyone should hold off on Ivermectin... alone... and especially with nattokinase, or K2/Mk-7 or quercetin. Not medical advice... but I ran across some info that is a bit alarming.

3/1/2023 06:47:58 pm

please share. I'm taking both

3/1/2023 07:09:19 pm

Yes, I have been taking Ivermectin every 2 weeks and I take K2 Mk-7 several times/week... nattokinase is closely related to the Mk-7 form of K2... and as he explains, combining quercetin may be problematic too. I am hoping that after 7 months... maybe the combo only affects certain people... and who knows... this guy may be totally wrong... but he seems to back up his talk... Since I have had Covid... I am hoping I now have pretty good immunity... but... if we have another of these pandemics... not sure what I'll follow as a protocol. https://www.bitchute.com/video/o5UcxYnieiAW/

Christine

3/2/2023 12:20:41 pm

Interesting video. FWIW, I take the Nattokinase form of NSK-SD which is the only form of nattokinase that does NOT contain K2. I know that doesn't address the quercetin aspect, but I avoid K2 anyway because it is pivotal in forming blood clots, which I am trying to avoid.

3/2/2023 12:26:11 pm

Yes, NSK-SD is the best... and the Ivermectin Vid may be flawed... lots of Ivermectin use in Japan, and they consume tons of natto (closely related to K2/Mk-7... so I wouldn't worry too much... still, since I had Covid... and should have good immunity... I'll take a break from Ivermectin... I might be experiencing some of the milder side effects...

Christine

3/2/2023 01:32:45 pm

I forwarded that video to my doctor who prescribed IVM and works closely with the FLCCC docs. Will be curious as to her response.

On the FLCCC website, I found this under the treatment protocols for covid:

"Due to a possible interaction between quercetin and ivermectin, these drugs should not be taken simultaneously (i.e., should be staggered at different times of day.) As supplemental quercetin has poor solubility and low oral absorption, lecithin-based and nanoparticle formulations are preferred."

3/2/2023 02:03:23 pm

And K2/Mk-7 is also a PGP inhibitor... so the concerns would be the same for it, if not worse... I think I may have been experiencing side effects from the combo for 7 months... hard to describe them, BP fine, pulse normal... but having anxiety, stomach not good and I just generally, many days, feel like crap. I guess I'm not as sharp as I thought I was... :-(
I sure hope things improve quickly... last Iver dose 1 week ago, last K2/Mk-7 dose, 2 days ago. Stopping both, of course.

3/19/2023 07:53:34 am

Hi JJ, wondering if you are still not taking Natto and ivm. I also stopped after watching that video but I would like to continue with the Natto daily and the ivm weekly. Did you do any follow up on that video?

3/19/2023 08:31:32 am

I had an email conversation with the pharmacist that filled my Iver prescription... he thought the video was "hyperbolic"... but did think that PGP inhibitors like K2/Mk-7 and nattokinase COULD reduce the effectiveness of Iver. Those with liver issues should probably not take Iver, unless hit with Covid. That said, he did not see much risk here.
I am considering going from once every 2 weeks to once/month, and not taking any PGP inhibitors the first week after the iver dose. I might even go to a 2-3 day dosing every quarter.

Since I am a fan of chlorine dioxide solution (CDS), and take it 1-2X/week... kills bacteria, viruses, fungus, perhaps anti-cancer... and other anti-virals like grapefruit seed extract are good... chaga or Reishi mushroom, oregano oil (too strong for me)... I think I have pretty good protection...

And I would not like to give up my regular dosing of lumbrokinase/serrapeptase, or nattokinase/serrapeptase.

DD link

3/17/2023 03:09:08 pm

JJ
I have two questions:
1) For inflammation and cleaning of arteries, can nattokinase 2000fu be taken with serrapeptase 12000spu and niacin 10000mcg on an empty stomach, and should it be once a day or twice a day? My other supplements, I would take an hour later with food.

2) For my husband who is two months post CABG, is this also a safe combination? He is still on a low dose of amiodarone (temporarily), atorvastin (temporarily), and carvedilol. He is already taking nattokinase (though not NSK-SD).

I have a difficult time deciding which brands to purchase. I seem to end up with many supplements in NOW brand, though I do have some Nutricost, Jarrow, Source Naturals, and a few others. Advice on supplement brands would be extremely helpful. Also advice on nattokinase vs NSK-SD would be helpful.

I realize you are not a doctor; I am interested in your opinion.

3/17/2023 05:21:54 pm

1.) I think that would depend on the problem you are addressing... nattokinase 2000fu is a standard dose... serrapeptase, I think you meant 120,000spu not 12,000spu... 120K spu is a heavy dose, IMO... if you have a very high c-reactive protein (C-rp) score, 120K spu may be called for... taking both twice a day is a lot. I think 2000fu nattokinase and 40,000spu serrapeptase is a good maintenance dose... Niacin... did you mean 10,000 mg, and not 10,000mcg? Niacin usually comes in mg, not mcg. 10,000mg daily of niacin is a heavy dose. The combination of all that you are thinking of taking is a LOT of blood thinning potential, and can be problematic, especially 2X/day. Time release niacin is VERY problematic, so avoid it. 500mg 2X/day is a standard dose of niacin, and is plenty, usually. Plenty of liposomal C may be a good idea... 2-4000mg daily, resveratrol, curcumin, ginger... inflammation busters...

Two months post CABG... your husband still needs to be closely monitored by a good cardio-doc and I would not add anything into his protocol without discussing it with them first... again, for him, that is a lot of blood thinning potential... if that level of blood thinning is not desired, lumbrokinase and serrapeptase is a great combo, might be a good alternative.
I'd keep it to 2000fu nattokinase and 40,000 spu serrapeptase... you can always increase. Niacin is great stuff, but again... talk it over... I would not do more than 500mg 2X/day initially...
I don't like statins much, I think the the enzymes and K2/Mk-7 are better bets. But they are ok for a short term, low-dose, imo... as they do fight inflammation. Cholesterol is not the devil, unless VERY high... inflammation is the beast.

Lots of brands of nattokinase... NSK-SD is a patented form, so assures quality, otherwise, Drs Best is probably OK, as is Solaray...

I found a good deal on Ebay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/204181850024 off brand, but the NSK-SD ensures it should be fine.

GL to you both!

DD link

3/17/2023 07:30:11 pm

To: JJ
Thank you so much for your reply! I tried to send you this in a return email, but i don’t know how these sites work.It is extremely hard to find someone to bounce things off of, which makes it so hard to decide what to take. I was searching whether or not it was ok for us to take niacin and nattokinase at the same time without food. I happened on the website, and noticed you answered many of the questions, and obviously know a lot about these supplements. From my reading I learned about the serrapeptase and the NKS-ND, and that I had a few more questions, and nobody to ask; that is why I reached out to you.

I did know about niacin vs niacinamide. What we have is sustained release niacin, NOW brand 500mg. I think I understand your opinion is that would not be a good choice. If I misunderstand, please correct me.

My husband has already started taking this niacin. His cardiologist does know, but doesn’t “recommend” it, because it is “useless. My husband’s numbers from his comprehensive metabolic panel are very good, so he plans to ask for an NMR or Cardio IQ blood test and discontinue the statin if that those numbers look good. We have the best cardiologist in the area, but all here adhere to the medical industrial complex ideology. If his cardiologist won’t order the blood work, we will look for a tele appointment with a functional medicine doc.

In addition to the niacin, he has been taking Nutricost nattokinase 2000FU, but it is not NSK-SD. We can go through this bottle and then order the NSK-SD, or just order the other now. I wasn’t sure whether or not to add serrapeptase for him now, or not; my thought was to add it once he discontinued his statin (so long as his bloodwork from requested tests come out looking good). He also already takes the K2-M7, and has been for a year or more. His doctor does know. I’m sure he thinks it is useless, but didn’t suggest he discontinue it.

He already takes the niacin and nattokinase but only once a day, and now plans to take them on an empty stomach - together. He also already takes K2-M7 and has for a year or so. His doctor wasn’t impressed, but didn’t tell him not to take it. He is also on the flccc preventative protocols (but not the ivermectin). In addition, for years he’s taken the usual - C, coq10, fish oil, Magnesium G.

We are both unvaccinated for Covid, but his former PCP did twist his arm in 2020 to take a flu shot (so his office numbers “would look good.” ) I was not there to put my foot down, so he caved. 72 hours later he was in AFIB (first time ever)with various other weird symptoms which lasted better than 6months.

My issues are very different. For many years I have take a handful of supplements twice a day. I am fighting insulin resistance, systemic inflammation, joint pain, fatigue, and quite a bit of stress since my husband began his heart problems. I have also noticed what feels like PVCs, which I had with two of my pregnancies, and various stressful times raising my #4 daughter. I have no intention of going down the pharmaceutical path, so I decided to research, take what I could to clean my arteries and fight the inflammation and insulin resistance.

I also had a round of significant hair loss after contracting Covid in 2021, and it still seems really thin, so I began biotin. In addition, Covid did a number on my vision and my foggy brain. My readers are now inadequate, and I’m having to use my cell phone, hence the misplaced 0’s in the dosages listed in my original post. The brands of niacin, nattokinase, and biotin are all the standard strengths of NOW and Nutricost, and I take according to label until I do more sesearch on dosing.

NOW brand Niacin 500mg sustained release

Nutricost Nattokinase 2,000FU

Nutricost Biotin B7 10,000MCG (Which, unless I’m nuts, SEEMS to translate to 10mg) - so I have no idea how much of this to take.

I’m wondering if I can take these three things gs first morning and before bed - together. I take my other supplements twice a day, when I eat.

This post is really long. I’m sorry. Sometimes I can get bogged down researching what to take and when to take it. The brain fog doesn’t help with the research, either. And now that I’m researching for both of us, since my husband’s decided to go a little rogue, I’m a mess. Thank you for any opinions you may give me.

3/17/2023 08:49:11 pm

I don't think taking niacin and nattokinase together is a problem... but why? First, time-release niacin can be problematic and I would never take it. Potential liver issues, and if taking other supplements and prescriptions... NOT good. I wake up nightly, being in my 60's... so I take my enzymes then... empty stomach. All other supplements I take with food, though liposomal C is fine without. I like to take my niacin (I don't like niacinamide, not as effective for cholesterol) with a meal or at least a little oat milk... and C at the same time... moderates the flush a bit... Niacin with a statin can increase muscle problems... perhaps Co-Q10 can avoid that... but since I am not a statin fan... if your husbands cholesterol numbers are good... just me, I'd dump the statin... you might replace with Bergamot... sounds like your Cardio-Doc is a Big Pharma stooge... like most Docs these days... unfortunate... if he poo-poos K2/Mk-7, he is, IMO, not a good Doc. I would try to get a 2nd opinion, if your insurance would handle that... It is a great supplement, take with D3 and zinc picolonate...
IF your husband's cholesterol numbers are normal or better, he probably clogged up due to inflammation... keep a sharp eye on those numbers C-reactive protein and maybe, homocysteine blood tests... have them done often. Get a Lipo(a) blood test too. LOts of anti-inflammation foods, garlic, ginger, cayenne, etc...
As mentioned, lose the time-release niacin. I also do not like Nutricost (sorry, cheap but often ineffective) and not a big fan of NOW supplements either, though some are alright. The NSK-SD form of nattokinase is worth the small extra cost, IMO. I buy SerraRX brand serrapeptase, due to the enteric coating... other brands like Drs Best may be OK... I take 80,000spu sometimes, other times 40,000spu. Always on empty stomach, of course.

I am a hardcore anti-vaxxer. The flu vaxx can cause big problems, and the flu shots will get FAR worse as they put mRNA/spike proteins into them. Covid "vaccines" are deadly, IMO.
You should look into CDS... first view the video:
https://www.brighteon.com/98239852-67cd-4675-89a2-4d1979c8e42d
A panacea? Hmmmmmm.... I have used it for years, no side effects... if resolved a nasty UTi in 3 days once...

If that is too 'far-out"... consider colloidal silver to boost your immune system. I use 'Sovereign Silver' 10ppm. 1-5 tsp/day, depending...
Ivermectin is great, especially if you had the Delta version of Covid... you can tell if you had bad lung problems... otherwise, it was probably Omicron. But Ivermectin does not dance well with PGP inhibitors, like K2/Mk-7, nattokinase, green tea or quercetin, to name a few... it is OK with lumbrokinase and serrapeptase...

Systemic inflammation... I think taking 120,000 spu of serrapeptase for a few months would be OK... split doses would be good... you can do 2000FU nattokinase 2X'day for a while too...
I don't think much of biotin... might improve hair quality a bit, but will not re-grow... I think stress/anxiety is the more likely culprit... Covid too, maybe... I'd suggest you have a comprehensive thyroid/hormone panel done. Bondi-boost spray (Walmart or Amazon) might help.
Anxiety causes PVCs too, I know this. Regular niacin helps a lot... I use low-dose cannabis too, you can take L-Theanine as well... I take D-Ribose if the palpitations get bad... seems to help.

Brain fog... IF it began with or right after Covid... it could be Long Covid... and Ivermectin/D3/Zinc might be best... or it could be stress/anxiety. Might ask for some Lorazepam, used responsibly, it is xlnt.

You might do a tele-appt with Dr Jerry Taylor, naturopathic MD. (406) 265-2250 He can prescribe Ivermectin too, if he and you agree it would be beneficial. Sound him out about all of this stuff, as remember, I am no Doc... I research a lot and have experienced a lot... but... ??? 🙂

Madeline

3/18/2023 07:32:18 pm

Loved reading all the comments. Very interesting human JJ. My issues are Hepatitis related and would love any feedback on this. I did not take the jab. I do work as a hairdresser and deal with many people that did get the V and am using the Nattokinaise 2 am 2 pm for the reasons stated about the spike protein. My other vitamins I take separately. NAC,liposomal C, D3 K2 10,000 daily. Quercetin, Vit E, Zinc and a few others.Thanks for your time.
I have not had any vaccines since they conned me into the HepB one about 20 years ago. So sorry I caved on that one.

3/18/2023 08:50:14 pm

I am not super familiar with Hepatitis ( I will assume Hep-C?)... but I think chlorine dioxide solution (CDS) would be MY first choice... a good starter video, posted before: https://www.brighteon.com/98239852-67cd-4675-89a2-4d1979c8e42d

Amazing stuff... and there ARE testimonials as to its success with Hep-C.

You might add a liver supplement, this one looks promising... but start slow, detox can be painful...
https://www.amazon.com/AUMETO-Tauroursodeoxycholic-Artichoke-Astragalus-L-Arginine/dp/B0B6HWWFVJ/ref=sr_1_28?crid=2C6CVW4KBS10X&keywords=tudca&qid=1679196831&sprefix=tud%2Caps%2C147&sr=8-28

It has a lot of the "usual suspects" for liver detox/health, and TUDCA is interesting...

Oregano oil is pretty amazing too, if you can tolerate it (I can't, gives me heart palps)...

I think I would consider juicing too... and LOTS of the liposomal C... I think 5,000mg daily would be a start... or to bowel tolerance... I take with food or juice.

Maybe consult with a Naturopath... one mentioned in previous comments...

I wish I knew more... GL to you!

Arria Brasseur

6/15/2023 02:57:44 pm

I have taken Nattokinase for a few years. I read about Serrapeptase and was very excited to try it. It made me SO sick. Vomit and bad stomach. I thought I had the flu and only realized it was the Serrapeptase when I took it again and got sick again. Dang!
Then I bought some Lumbrokinase. I took half a dose and still became a bit sick. Not nearly as bad as the Serrapeptase.
I really want to add one or both to my supplements. What am I doing wrong? Any suggestions?

6/15/2023 06:10:18 pm

Unusual, even rare, but not unheard of... if you read the lowest rated reviews on serrapeptase products on Amazon, you will find that a few people had the same problem... one indicated that if allergic to antifungals or penicillin, you should avoid... I had not heard that... bad reactions to lumbrokinase are much more rare.
It could also be the extra/inactive ingredients... some can cause real problems...
I've been taking both for years with no problems, but nattokinase makes me feel a little ill... might be a histamine thing... not sure...
Since you don't have any problems with nattokinase... I would just stick with that... you don't really need any of the other two if that works for you. I do suggest you stick with the NSK-SD form of nattokinase, it is more reliable... others DO work though...
BTW: Look into Methylene Blue, my current "cure all"!! :-)

Lisa

6/22/2023 07:39:36 am

Hi, i am 50, I just had the coronary calcium test done and scored a 59.5, they said had a few pockets on left and one on right.

I ordered Nattokinase 100mg and drs best d3 25mcg +k2 180mcg combo. Haven’t started those yet.

I also take a multi vitamin and vitamin E and tumeric ginger supplement.
I’m also on a Antibiotic for sinus- amox/k clav 875-125mg because of sinus issues and 4 surgeries later they can’t fix it, have been on those long term? Any suggestions.

Can you advise If these are all ok to take or if you suggest doing something different. Thanks!

6/22/2023 04:57:44 pm

Lisa, a 59 Calcium score is not that bad... I would not get too upset about it... IF it were me (not medical advice), I would add SerraRX 80,000 Serrapeptase to your mix, and add at least 2000 iu D3. I would take the nattokinase 2X/day (empty stomach only) or, as I prefer, switch to Lumbrokinase instead of the nattokinase. IF you stay with nattokinase, which is fine, I would make sure and buy the NSK-SD version. The "Nature's Answer" brand is a bargain. I would add bergamot to your mix too. I would use up your nattokinase first even if you intend to switch to lumbrokinase, which is 30X stronger in fibrolynic action.

Personally, I REALLY do not like long term antibiotics. Your gut biome must be thrashed by now. I suggest you look into Methylene Blue, Sloan has a good book on it on Amazon, $13 or so. An alternative is Chlorine Dioxide Solution (CDS), Dr. Andres Kalcker is the expert, he has a good "CDS for newbies" video:
https://www.brighteon.com/98239852-67cd-4675-89a2-4d1979c8e42d
Either (not both) would be better than long term antibiotics, IMHO.

Turmeric and ginger are both blood thinning... so is nattokinase and E. So is serrapeptase if you add it... so maybe hold off for a bit or reduce the Turm/ginger.

Serrapeptase is said to be better at dissolving arterial plaque than either nattokinase or lumbrokinase, which are both much better at preventing/dissolving blood clots. Serrapeptase is also great for reducing inflammation. I do not recommend taking aspirin in any dose with it.

Lisa

6/22/2023 07:57:11 pm

JJ,

Thank you so much for answering, I was just a little shocked about the score so thank you for easing the anxiousness. All of this is super new, I am very open to try new things, and I have a couple more questions if you don’t mind.

You said 2000 d3, I read to put K2 mk7 with it, do you think that is ok and if so what amt of k2 would you recommend to get with the d3.

As for the lumbrokinase do you prefer a certain brand and dosage, and I’m assuming I can take that with the serrapeptase and or nattokinase (on an empty stomach), my goal is to try to dissolve the plaque and then maintenance.

As for the sinus thank you I will def look into the 2 you suggested, I am ready to get off the antibiotics that’s for sure. Yes I’m sure my gut biome is a complete disaster by now. When Covid hit I was going to do plasma infusions to try to heal so I wouldn’t need the antibiotics (per dr) ) but something hit me about that with all the vaccines and blood and unknown so I decided to decline that and just stay on the antibiotics. I am not Covid vaxxed or never got tested and would love to try these options you suggested to heal! I am 100% ready to get off the antibiotics and heal other ways. Thank you again for all the help, I appreciate it!

6/22/2023 08:33:52 pm

You are very welcome... check everything I say with a Doc, preferably a naturopath.

I said ADD 2000 iu D3, I think your intake should total 5000iu daily, like I take, but some may think that's a bit high, I do not. Yes, K2 works best with D3, I think 100mcg of K2 is OK, perhaps 2X/day for a month to help clean things out... serrapeptase and bergamot will help with that too.

I would finish the nattokinase you have, check for side effects, (nattokinase gave me mild side effects) then perhaps switch to lumbrokinase... I would not take both... but you can (should) take serrapeptase (plaque buster) with either, perhaps at different times of the day, all of them should be taken on an empty stomach. I like regular (not time-release) Niacin, I don't mind the flushing...

Brands of lumbrokinase... if you are wealthy, take Boluoke brand... if not, I like Etta/Vita (Amazon)... Drs Best is OK.

I took Ivermectin when I had Covid (mild case), and still take it once or twice/month. You might consider it. I am not vaxxed either, thank God.
You might give Methylene blue a try, to help keep infections away after stopping the antibiotics (your Doc should know better than to keep you on them for so long, consider a change, JMHO)... MB's only big contraindication is if you are taking any SSRI or other serotonin boosting drug. MANY other benefits... should help with any left over Covid symptoms too, so do the enzymes, of course. Here is some info, Dr. Berg is a good guy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dDUZ0ODBfJs&t=119s

Hope it all helps... remember NOT medical advice! :-)

Lisa

6/24/2023 07:10:46 am

Thank you :).

Dallas

7/6/2023 10:38:08 am

Hi, JJ, thanks for still responding to all the questions about nattokinase, etc.! I've bookmarked this page.

I have a quick question for you. Do you think that nattokinase, serrapeptase, or lumbrokinase capsules containing rice flour, stearates, maltodextrin, or other products (besides maybe cellulose) are ineffective? Or at least, not as effective as a product that doesn't have these fillers?

I ask because it's always suggested to "take on an empty stomach". Rice flour, etc., however small an amount, seems counter-productive.

Thanks for your opinion on this question.

7/6/2023 11:16:42 am

Hi, Dallas... I avoid maltodextrin because it can cause gut issues, and I already have those! I don't think stearates are a big problem, especially magnesium stearate... and rice flour is pretty benign too... microcrystalline cellulose is a bad one, any "dioxides" are also to be avoided.
I think Etta Vita brand lumbrokinase is a good one...
Best naturals and Carlyle serrapeptase are free of the bad stuff and cheap.
Boluoke brand lumbrokinase used to be the very best... but I believe they now produce synthetic stuff, instead of actual earthworm extracts... Etta Vita still does real earthworms.
I doubt that even maltodextrin would render either inactive... but why not avoid?
I don't use nattokinase, as I get mild side effects and it is far less powerful than the lumbro...
Source Naturals NSK-SD is a good deal, and the form you want if you do take nattokinase... IMO, no ned for BOTH lumbro and nattokinase... but either can be taken along with serrapeptase, though I would maybe take them separately (might not be necessary)...
Yes, taking on an empty stomach is essential, or they will become digestive enzymes... not what you want.

NOT medical advice!! ;-)

Michael

7/22/2023 05:16:35 am

Good Morning. Is it safe to take L Arginine and Nattokinase for legs issue? I take them several hours apart… I have noticed less swelling of the veins and less pain. Thank you!

Michael

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